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I wanted to say that discussion is good as it helps develop a working knowledge of how the van works (important when trying to diagnose problems). I just did a search on TVP and found an old thread (similar to this one) from way back in 2008. Here's a link: http://www.toyotavanpeople.com/forum...php?f=2&t=4311 . In my post you will see I'm also calling it the "idle-up / pressure-up temperature switch" :)...........I wonder where I got that from? :doh: :LOL2:. Tim
Tim and Rawb, this discussion is very educational. I read the linked TVP post and the service bulletin but I'm not sure I understand everything ... maybe someday I will. Tim, your saying that if I am not having a hot-soak issue, and I don't have AC (even though I used to have it), I can safely ignore the water (idle-up) temperature switch? It sounds like I could replace the switch with a plug. Would that be OK? My water temperature switch appears to be bad since there is resistance between the switch's terminal and ground when the engine is cold. Is there any reason to take action?Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
If you're not having a heat soak issue then I'd ignore the temp switch. If there's continuity between the switch terminal & ground when the van is cold, that means the switch is bad.........but in this case bad is good :thmbup:. I don't think it matters much what you do regarding that switch. If you ever start having heat soak problems then I'd just cut the wire and ground it out. At that point your switch effectively becomes a "fancy" plug. If a simple plug makes you feel better then do that instead. I pulled my water temp switch and used that spot to put a 220 deg N.O. temp switch. I wired it to a bright LED in my dash. I also put an annoying piezo buzzer on that circuit so I will be alerted if temp ever exceeds 220 deg F. I wired my oil pressure switch to the alarm circuit as well so I get the same annoying warning if oil pressure ever drops below 4psi. If it ever goes off then I'll need to check my gauges to see what caused it (oil pressure or temperature), then immediately take the appropriate action. Tim
I got rid of code 11 and restored proper timing advance by replacing my TPS. Code 4 disappeared somewhere along the way, perhaps when I insulated chaffed wires at my water temp sensor connector.
Still have a very rough idle when the engine is cold. My cold start injector time switch tests bad. All other EFI components appear to be good. Rawb, you listed Beck/Arnely 1580034 for cold start injector time switch. I can't find this part listed for the van at rockauto.com. Is there a place to cross reference Toyota part numbers with after market part numbers? On Toyodiy.com I see Toyota 89462-30011 "SWITCH, START INJECTOR TIME" for my Canadian issue 87 LE. This part is available for about the same price ($140 - $150) as B/A 1580034. Is there any reason not to go with the Toyota part? Is there an less expensive aftermarket alternative? Can anybody confirm that Toyota part number? I am hesitant to spend $150 without being certain that I am ordering the right part.
Any guidance would be welcome :cnfsd:.
%%% EDIT / UPDATE %%%%
Cheapest place I could find a genuine Toyota cold start injector time switch was 'autohausaz' .com. $136 and free shipping. All other toyota parts websites wanted to charge me $15 - $25 for shipping, and autohausaz had the lowest price I could find by $10 - $20. I ordered it and hope the new switch solves my cold-engine rough idle. Honestly, though, I don't understand exactly how it will. My CSITS is basically a switch that is stuck on. The switch is supposed to be on when cold and off when hot. So my switch is always telling the cold start injector to spray extra fuel, right? Somebody correct me if I am on the wrong track.
Sorry if my posts have taken this thread for a turn away from the code 11 & 4 topic. Please reassign if appropriate.
Hey guys -
first off I have dug through and read everything above - Im kind of wanting some more opinions and wisdom though.
Brand new owner of an 87 4wd automatic, bought it 2 days ago. Im not a mechanic nor do I have much experience with internal combustion engines, I did do some electric conversions on VW's though in the past. Thats about it for my mechanical experience.
Thank you guys for your forum, I have already learned so much.
My wife and I fell in love with this van when we saw it for sale, decided to get rid of the Sequoia for something that represented us a little more accurately =). My wife went and bought it, drove it around for a day without a problem (aside from it taking 5 minutes to start from cold, and a while to warm up). She took off on a trip so I was left with the van today.
Factoids for context:
It took me 15 minutes to get the thing started today, tried cycling the fuel pump (turning the key to on or start 3 times). It was parked on a steep hill so I thought that might have some role in it.
Researched how to get error codes from the ECU, code 4 and 11. Now, the guy I bought it from said it needed a new ECU, he thought the fuel pump was bad, but said he had it tested and the pressure was fine, so chalked it up to an ECU, which he had lying around. I put in the other ECU (he graciously let me have) and one of the vacuum valves kept clicking on and off, and the van would not start. Put the old one back in. It started. I don't think the ECU is an issue.
I decided to load the kids up to buy a new guinea pig from the pet store. Along the way the van completely turned off. We pulled over, it took a few attempts but it started back up, idling very low around 500-600. I test drove it around and it kept losing power. It would drive great sometimes for about 20 seconds, and then the next second I couldn't get it to shift, totally lagging and stalling, sounded like the throttle being completely turned off and back on again. Again - it would drive great for a moment, then stalling / not shifting with it seeming like the throttle was off / on.
We managed to get it home, way back up the hill (going about 15 mph and the engine sounding LOUD). I can't even determine where to start, it felt like the vacuum system losing vacuum, but I checked all the lines and could not find an issue. Also, yes the car had gas.
I know error 11 is not that bad, but could the error code 4 be the most of it? For the most part, Im thinking :
#1 - Fix the water temp sensor issue.
if #1 does not resolve investigate the fuel pump and fuel filter.
If that does not work?
Thanks guys. Really want to get this thing running well.
Pretty sure I found the main issue which seems to be a short in one of the harnesses going to the ECU. Looks like someone had done some work there. While I have the van running, if I move the harness in question just a bit, I can hear one of the VSV valves click, and the motor bogs down / dies. Hopefully redoing these wires will fix the main problem, don't know if it is the also the cause of error 4 and 11. Picking up a new multimeter to test the ECU and sensors.
Status update:
Replaced TPS sensor, this cleared up error code 11. I put a new water temperature thermistor in (other one had no continuity, and new one tested good), unhooked battery, tested codes again, still code 4. Checked the new temperature thermistor and it checked out bad. Weird. Will put another one in.
Since the van still drives like crap, Ive been trying to test anything and everything I can, replaced the ignition coil (without taking off the distributor, which is painful but I don't have a timing light yet.) because the secondary coil had no continuity / resistance. Put it back together, it started up after a minute of trying, which is an improvement.
When I first start the van It barely has any power, idles sometimes at 750 which it should but sometimes at about 1100. Giving it gas makes it sound like its going to die until its warmed up. It will still die on me while driving, starts dropping power intermittently. Shuts off sometimes while driving.
If I tap on the outside of the van where the ECU is while its running, it will shut off. Could not find a short in the harness. Tested with other ECU and it does the same thing. Tested all voltage / resistance at every ECU port. Im at a loss.
Hey Dob,
Did you ever figure out your problem? I'm having a somewhat similar bogging/rough running when warmed up and Code 4 when I wiggle the wires to the sensor or cold start. I'm gonna check continuity today but I think it's in the wiring right at those sensors.
Hello all,
So since I bought my van back in November, it's had an issue where when I first start when the engine is cold, it putters out and dies. I'll then have to start it again, anywhere up to a maximum of four times if it's really cold outside. I haven't thought much of it and have marked it off as a nuisance while I fixed other problems, but now I have time and money to address the problem (hopefully).
Beyond this, after I've driven around for a while then park the van for a bit (for like an hour or so), when I come back to it and start it again it will start but seems a little weak and kind of putters. If I start to drive right away it will struggle a bit but eventually "come-to" and be back to normal. The same will happen if I sit and let it idle for a while until it stops the puttering.
So my question is, what do you all think this is? I think it's likely a vacuum leak, but am not sure. I would appreciate y'alls advice as you are true experts! Thanks!
There are several things that it could be, but here are a couple of quick and easy things to do first.
Check your cold-start injector. Remove it, clean it, and test it to confirm it is working properly.
Check your air intake hose for cracks, rips, or damage of any kind.
Replace your fuel filter. If you haven't changed it, I bet the person you bought the van from didn't either.
A full tune up might be a good idea. I suggest spending a few extra bucks for iridium spark plugs.
How many miles are on your van?
Always check for stored codes
Always diagnose problems prior to doing other maintenance/repairs
CC's list is a good start, but you still need to know if the computer has logged any faults.
Van has 125,000 miles on it.
I checked the codes and observed the following, would they have anything to do with it?
I read the codes by shorting the check engine connector and got what I think are two codes. I pulled the code number 4 and code number 11.
For code number 4, the manual says that it's an open or short circuit in water temperature sensor signal.
For code number 11 , the manual says that "Air conditioner switch ON, idle switch OFF or shift position in any other position other than P or N range during diagnosis check." Which the van was in P when I did the check. The air conditioner is disconnected (the belt is disconnected), so would that have something to do with this code (code number 11, that is)?
I also recently replaced the air intake hose (the big one right on top under the driver seat), so that doesn't seem to be my problem.
Thanks!
Here's a PDF of the diagnostic codes:
Attachment 6883
A bad water temp sensor (or messed up sensor plug wiring) would explain your symptoms.
Did you touch the throttle at all while reading the codes? If you take it off idle while the check engine connector is connected it can throw a false 11. If not there is a lot on this forum about the 11 code.
I'm having an identical problem. What is the intake plenum gasket and where is it located?Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyBird
Soooo, it turned out that there was a cable physically unplugged from the sensor on coolant filler neck:
Attachment 7006
Plugging this back in resolved the issue of hard starting, now it starts on the first turn and continues to run! Also, both codes are gone and have been gone for the past 200 miles or so
The only issue I'm facing at this point is that, after I park it after driving (for long enough to where the van reaches operating temp) and let it sit for a while (10+ minutes), it has issues starting. It struggles in a similar manner as before, just kind of idling weakly unless I floor the gas pedal, after which I hear a whoosh of air and it idles normally.
Any ideas on what this may be?
Hello all! Hope you are well.
After figuring out that the rough start from cold issue was due to one wire being completely disconnected (see below), I have resolved codes 4 and 11 (have driven around 100 miles, codes aren't coming back :)).
Attachment 7016
Red arrow points to wire that was disconnected. Where the wire connects is circled in red. It's just kind of sitting in there right now. Is there a sensor that's supposed to go there?
Now I am facing the issue that the van has trouble starting after I have driven it around for a while and then parked it for > 15 minutes. It struggles and idles rough for a minute, then if I take off and give it gas I hear a whooshing sound and the van is back to normal.
Any ideas what this might be?
Thanks!
That picture is of the coolant filler neck by the way, just for reference.
Could anyone clarify….is that the “idle-up/water temperature switch” that has been mentioned many times as a spot to ground for help with Heat-soak?
Yes, that is the one.