Sounds like the aux air valve is working properly then; I would leave it alone. Unless of course you're willing to risk another problem (the one I referred to, and it's a pain) ...
Gwen
Sounds like the aux air valve is working properly then; I would leave it alone. Unless of course you're willing to risk another problem (the one I referred to, and it's a pain) ...
Gwen
In the powered off state should i be able to blow through the air valve???
Not 100% sure this is related to the thermostat, but my 87 4x4 5sp has been idling really high once warmed up (after 5 minutes or so). It hasn't been overheating, and other than the constant sound of a revving engine when in neutral or the clutch is engaged, it's driving normally. A friend mentioned it could be a thermostat issue. Has anyone had this issue before?
If the van warms-up and the heater blows hot air, then it's not related to the thermostat. It could be a failed air valve (between the intake manifold halves). When the coolant is cold, the air valve allows air flow (increases idle speed). When the coolant is hot, the air valve closes and prevents air flow (slower speed). To test, warm the van, then pinch an air tube going to or from the air valve. If the idle speed goes down, then you have a failed air valve. Tim
Thanks Tim! I'll search for the air valve later this week. Much appreciated!Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
don't mean to hijack but i wonder if my auxiliary air valve is bad (part number 22230-73011)? this is the part you're referring to right? I can't test because i already have the intake and exhaust manifold (and a bunch of other stuff) pulled right now and I'm just replacing everything in sight basically.Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
is there another way to test? I did notice that this past winter (my first winter with the van) it did idle very low on cold starts - treading the line very finely of cutting out. Would this be a symptom of a bad valve? Is there an aftermarket part available? looks like its NLA.
The 87 van service manual shows how to test in more detail (pages FI-59 - FI-60). If you don't already have a copy, you can view/download here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1q4u...7wOD7nKyF/view. If you're viewing that version, it's PDF pages 167 - 168. Tim
oh great, thanks tim. i always forget to consult the FSM first :doh:Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
this part looks NLA? any aftermarket? or just grab one at a pick n pull and pray it works?
heres a screenshot of those pages:
http://i.imgur.com/HWEmlPy.png
http://i.imgur.com/Mxc4iN0.png
PS: Yes, it's Toyota part #22230-73011. They are spendy and a PITA to replace (unless you already have the intake apart). I've never actually had to replace one with new (was always able to find a good used one when needed). I see there's one listed on eBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fuel-Injecti...JZJcHF&vxp=mtr. You used to be able to get aftermarket ones off rockauto until just a year or so ago, but it appears now they are gone. Even those were expensive........just not as bad as OE.
The symptom of a bad one is having correct idle speed when cold but high idle when hot (if it's stuck open) -OR- having a low idle speed when cold, but a correct idle speed when hot (if it's stuck closed).
Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
ok perfect, i think that should give me enough info to troubleshoot after work and hopefully determine if its bad. id hate to have to pull the intake again seeing as I've already got it all torn apart right now :)
just saw that there was another thread on this so ill let this thread get back to its original topic!
Posts about Auxiliary Air Valve relocated to the pre-existing thread — THANKS for the heads-up and link, mistershmi !!! :thmbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by mistershmi
Gwen
My aux. air valve has been bad for years, and while I have gotten used to having to turn up my idle speed in the winter and keep my foot on the gas while warming up (I've gotten really good at using the e-brake) I was waiting for an excuse to replace it and fix an exhaust manifold leak. That excuse has finally come (blown head gasket) but imagine my disappointment at learning it was NLA after waiting for years to fix it! I didn't see the eBay listing Tim mentioned but found another NOS valve on eBay that I was prepared to pay an exorbitant amount for, believing it was the last one in existence! I probably outbid someone else on this forum to get it. Sadly, the hoses that attach to the valve are also NLA (though one dealer's site tricked me into trying to order them) so unless anyone has a recommendation I guess I'll try to find similar hoses at the local auto shop. I don't think straight hose will be able to handle those sharp 90 degree bends.
The one on eBay was an auction and was at around $30-40 when i bid on it with 30 seconds left. I bid it all the way up to $120-130 and still couldn't secure the max bid before the auction ended. I think someone had already set a really high max bid or had a bidding bot.... anyway it ended up going for almost $160. Not too bad I suppose for being probably the last brand new part in existence, but still more than I was wiling to pay, lol.
the hose won't fit those bends - I'm battling that issue right now. it kinks up badly. let me know how you end up figuring it out!
my aux valve MIGHT be okay, since i don't have to play the e-brake/gas game at stops like you do. it only happens on the initial warm up in winter. Even then it usually manages to stay just high enough to idle without dying, but it takes it a while to warm up as a result (unless i give it a little help, lol)
Lol, I had a snipe bid of $150.01 on it. The snipe site I use is supposed to go max bid within the last 7 or 8 seconds of the auction. When I set my max price there was 7 hrs left with 2 bids and price was at ~$26. When I got home that night I was actually surprised to learn I wasn't the winner :doh:. I guess I screwed up earlier by telling somebody to go search eBay for one. Lol. Tim
Yeah that was me, but i didn't get it either :LOL2:
Maybe someone here did! Whoever it was.... i will find you
Lol, it was Hammervan. He mentioned it post #20 this thread. Tim
LOL, yup it was me that won that eBay auction. I figured anyone else that wanted it was probably on this forum but I didn't realize the competition was so fierce! I actually placed my bid before I saw this thread, so you can't blame me for whipping up the frenzy! My max bid was Toyota's original retail price since I figured that's what I would have had to pay if it was still available, and if I didn't get it I wasn't sure what I would do. I actually thought about bidding way more just to make sure! Obviously I need to get more high tech to ward off the snipers! It gets cold here in SLC so I'm excited to have a van that idles in the winter.
I got a few shaped hoses from the local auto parts store that should work. One is a 1/2" hose which is a bit snug but should get the job done.
This guy on eBay still has 2 left http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fuel-Injecti...JZJcHF&vxp=mtr, but I just can't bring myself to pay $285 for one. I would go $150, but any more, I'd rather take my chances with a good used one (I still have a few of those laying around). Glad I got all the molded rubber hoses when I did (now that they're like hen's teeth). It's a bummer when these type parts become NLA. I really wish I would have purchased a few more sets back when you could still get them. Tim
If that part was easier to get to I might have tried a junk yard one. The Dayco 80393 hose cut to fit will work to replace the NLA hoses (22233-73010, 22236-73011, 22237-73010), it's a bit snug (1/2" vs the 14 mm nipples). It's about a third of the price at Rockauto than my LPS, wish I'd found it there first:
http://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo....960801&jsn=259
Awesome! This is exactly the kind of information that makes forums worth while. FWIW, i thought these were 14mm, but didn't have one handy to measure. For vacuum, being a bit snug is better than being loose (no hose clamps needed). I just purchased a few of those for future projects. Tim
Oops! I mentioned the standard to metric difference in a different thread where this topic was recently discussed but incorrectly said they were 12mm. My only issue with the stretch fit was out of concern that they may split as they dry out and shrink from the heat. Of course I had alternate options at the dealer several years ago when I did my HG. I suppose it's a moo point now.Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
https://68.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l...ef8lo1_250.gif
Oh man, thanks Hammervan! I was about to just put the OEM's back on and try my luck. They were in decent shape but definitely older. I just ordered 3 sections of the Dayco 80393 hose that you linked to replace the 3 sections with the sharp bends.
BTW im in SLC too, so I'm going to hunt you down for taking my aux air valve :rol:
Oh man, when my aux air valve suddenly disappears from my van, I'll know who took it, mistershmi! I'll keep my eyes peeled for your van, I see a few still running around Salt Lake but they all seem to be 2WD. Glad the hose info was helpful.
Of course, now that I've replaced the hoses on the aux. air valve, including the 8 mm coolant hose, I've now noticed Tim's mention in another thread that it's best to use the original Toyota spring clamps and genuine Toyota hose for the coolant line. I used the same 5/16 fuel line hose and regular hose clamps like I did on my Hose of Death. Not sure if it's worth putting the original hose back on before I put it all together...
Just a heads up. I just tried to buy one of these with some expendable cash I had, to save myself tracking one down later if the part ever fails on my van, and they had to refund my money. They don't actually have them in stock and had to go to the dealer where they learned they were NLA. Said he would be removing the auction listing.Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
Back when I used to sell there eBay required sellers to have physical possession of items before listing them. I guess that must have changed. I've purchased things from eBay before only to receive things drop-shipped from other locations. Next time I needed them I went right to the company who drop shipped and saved some money. I guess there's nothing wrong with sellers doing that as long as item arrives in a timely manner........just seems a bit fishy though. Glad you got your money back. Tim
PS: Funny how van parts just disappear from existence without warning. With the prices Toyota was asking I figured they'd be around for a long time. :doh: Tim
This is one of those stupid things you swear you can find, but then you get stuck on something. My mechanic has been doing quite a bit of work on my engine. Recently did a head gasket repair and when put back together realized engine was running rough. Since engine hasn't run in quite some time, he concluded that he thinks the problem is the fuel injectors, but upon working on them, all the injector connectors were deteriorating. Also he said the cold start injector connector and the IAC valve connector were deteriorated, and we have found pretty much every connector except for the IAC valve. Would any of you happen to know where I can find one? I've looked around Rockauto.com which has a pretty good selection of parts, but alas, no IAC valve connector. Or would anyone happen to know if these connectors were used on other Toyotas and/or different years and models? Even if someone has a picture of this thing, that would be very helpful. After this thing is done being worked on, I'm going to sell it, so stay on the lookout for a upcoming posting for an 1985 Toyota van that's had a ton of work done to it. Thanks for reading, all, and good luck.
My mechanic also just sent me these pictures. This is what we're working with.
Attachment 5574
Attachment 5575
Attachment 5576
I had that same issue, and ended up replacing this and all the connectors under the hood.
For a lot of them — and I believe this one you are after is included — you can use this connector available from Parts Geek: http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/198...connector.html
They also stock them at O'Reilly Auto Parts, but I'm not at the shop where I have the part number handy.
If you look closely at the enlarged view of the photo, you'll see there is a notch in the plastic connector. For the coolant sensor it is in the center. For some of the other things that use it, like the IAC, the notch may be in a different spot. Since this was the only connector available that I could find and that was the only difference, I just made my own notch where needed to make it work. Hope that helps.
--
And if you need it, here is the TPS connector, which is a little different. http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/198...connector.html
Hi all.
Newish '86 van owner and currently idling very rough upon starting (needs foot on gas or will sputter and stall). After warming up, about 3-5 minutes, things tend to smooth out. Recently had the fuel pump - which had died - replaced and my mechanic friend suggested replacing the air valve to assist with the early start idling issues. I'm looking for the part but haven't had much luck. Any suggestions on where to purchase an "air valve" as diagrammed above? Is "air valve" even the right name for the part?
Thanks! This forum has been a blast to read and refer...
I would look for vacuum leaks.
The air valve only provides high idle during warm up.
Mine never worked. And my van idles smooth.
Also try jumpering the fuel pump and see if that improves any thing. Not enough air flowing through the maf will make the fuel safety switch flicker. I have to step on the gas peddle a little to start my van. I little more air helps turn on the fuel pump.
Also check timing and fuel pressure.
Thanks for the response. My next move is to replace the fuel pressure regulator and check the timing.
I recently got the last new air valve in existence off ebay (as chronicled here http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...air+valve+ebay) and it made a huge difference in how my van idles when cold. I don't need to depress the gas when starting and keep it there until warmed up. It's an easy part to test and see if it's the culprit. I wonder if the air valve off another Toyota would fit, the ones I see at the junk yard look very similar, it would just have to fit in the small space between the manifolds unless you relocated it.
I'm sure that this has all been learned since 2012, but, just in case this is new information ... here it is --Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
there are 4 types of isc vsv's listed here... the 4th one seems to be for the "on-off" control VSV that it says is for the 4Y-E engines...
apparently, among other things, there is an "Electrical load idle- up" mode
Attachment 6209
page 10 on the pdf
There are 2 ways that the ISC VSV is shown to be plumbed...
the diagram we're all familiar with is as follows ...Attachment 6557
here, the rear port goes to the throttle body
Now, for the other way...Attachment 6558
here, my vacuum sticker ('87 2wd/auto/) clearly shows that the FRONT port goes to the throttle body---
if I'm not mistaken, this is a "one-way" valve, so, hooking it up backwards could be an issue...
for what it's worth, this valve's solenoid clearly clicks when my van is warmed up and i rev the throttle ...and my vacuum gauge shows "closed initially" , and, "open after solenoid click" (this is with the vacuum gauge hooked up to the rear/inboard port which leads to the big intake hose) ...
so..., obviously since the valve is receiving a constant vacuum pull at the hose from the throttle-body, I plumbed it as my sticker shows (on the front/outboard port)---
(I don't think it can go either direction like a BVSV)
I just want to know what's the right setup
okay... sorry if I wasted anyone's time... I just applied 12 volts to the ISC VSV and blew through the ports, and, it turns out that air flows in either direction when it's open, so, both diagrams for hose routing will work fine. On another note, I also find that, with the van warmed up and idling, turning on the lights has no effect on idle and does not open the VSV... So, it doesn't seem to be an "electrical load idle-up" feature...(I expected the electrical load to activate the valve and see an increase in idle speed similar to when you turn the steering wheel when parked at idle and the RPM's rise a little from the power-steering idle-up feature). However, when starting an already warmed up van and idling, the valve is initially closed, but, when I rev the throttle a couple times- the solenoid clicks and stays open (even when the engine returns to idle). So, I'm glad it works but I still kind of have no idea why it's there.
Hi Tim,Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
Is there a thread detailing the least painful way of removing/installing an idle air control valve? Mine is bad and I'm going to try to get one off a parts van this afternoon. Any help would be greatly appreciate.
Thanks!
Sorry, no magic bullet here. That valve is actually bolted to the underside of the top half of the intake, so it has to come off before you can remove the air valve. Here it is in all it's glory:
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23...pst6qweov0.jpg
Thanks Tim,Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv
The only description in the FSM that discusses access to this area is for a cylinder head removal, which includes opening the full engine compartment, draining the oil and coolant, and removing the exhaust pipe, throttle body, power steering pump, etc. Do you recall if all of that is necessary to access the idle air control valve?
Also, I found this while searching the web for the NLA part:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/...ac)+valve,6072
The part numbers don't match, but it says it's compatible with our vans. And it's cheap! Probably too cheap. There's only one left. Thoughts?
That's not the air valve. There's a discrepancy regarding the aftermarket part manufacturers terminology vs Toyota's. We call that part the AC Idle-up Diaphragm. To find out more about it CLICK HERE and scroll down to the middle of the page.
You don't need to remove the cylinder head to remove the air valve. You just need to remove the top half of the intake manifold. Of course that's not quite as easy as it might sound. There's a lot of other little things that need to be removed before you can do that. You might want to read the Hose of Death thread and cut an access hole in the back of the engine hump (as shown there). Having that access hole is an enormous help when removing the metal pipes from the back of the upper intake. Search the site for for more information on the other steps. Threads that discuss head gasket jobs should mention steps for removal of the upper intake. The information is here, the trick is finding it. If you're not having luck with the site search feature, use Google or other similar search engine (as talked about HERE). Tim
Great, thanks Tim! I really appreciate the help!Quote:
Originally Posted by timsrv