Except the alternator belt is frayed. Just on one edge. I assume that means pulleys are out of alignment. I'm about to give up on this project!Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
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Except the alternator belt is frayed. Just on one edge. I assume that means pulleys are out of alignment. I'm about to give up on this project!Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
Looking back over the photos earlier in this thread, it appears that the bolt I loosened today -- which was already loose (seems like that would be a problem in itself) -- is the wrong one. It's on the front of a small pulley in front of the alternator and not where the red-highlighted bolt is in the pics. I probably ought to have re-checked the photos first. But I *was* able to turn the wing nut (holding one of the wings with vice grips, which I probably would not have needed if I had first loosened the correct bolt). The bolt on the front of the small pulley won't tighten up, it just spins and spins.
If there are misaligned pulleys, I assume that is the cause of the alternator belt fraying only on one edge (the front). I don't know if the belt is in danger of busting or something due one edge being frayed. The rubber seems to be in good shape it's just the cloth backing that's a bit ragged looking. And, not knowing which pulleys need to be aligned, nor how to align them, apparently I am doomed to a few days of hunting for these details in previous topics. Hope the weather stays reasonable until I find the right info!
Could I have opinions from some of you experienced folk on this one question: With an alternator belt that is just a bit frayed on one edge (the backing only, not the rubber), is the vehicle good to drive without much risk of the belt going bad all of a sudden? I mean, for all I know, once a belt starts to fray, it's going to be useless in very short order. Or it could last for thousands of miles. I did tighten it and stopped the squealing. If I thought I could get it changed in one day, I would do it, but with the possibility of pulleys being out of alignment (as a cause of the fraying on one edge only) and not having a clue as to how to remedy that situation, it could end up taking me a lot longer, and it wouldn't make sense to replace the belt without fixing the cause of the uneven wear at the same time. Right?
ETA: I just learned from talking to an auto parts guy that the alternator bolt being stripped ciould be the cause of the fraying and that it would need to have a "helicoil" procedure done. Also that I should look for burrs on the pulley. Assuming this to be good info. Do y'all agree?
I would at the very least keep an extra belt on hand... If there's a belt that is going to leave you stranded, that's the one. Takes out the cooling system AND the electrical integrity of the van.Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
Personally, I would just change it and be done. My spidey sense tells me your not going to be able to swap it out without help of some sort...
It's time to collect all your cans and bottles and take it to a shop.
Hey thanks Dude! While you were posting the above, I was editing my last post. Check the last part of it and lemme know what ya think?Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
Well... that pulley bolt being stripped is a problem. And a helicoil is going to be beyond your skill set in my opinion. gonna require some precise drilling, tapping/ threading and a removal of the alternator.
As for the pulley itself, my recommend is to replace it If it's all burred up.
Time to just realize your in a pickle and maybe a bit over your head with this repair.
Do you happen to know the correct part number for the alt. belt? Or at least whether or not it's a "serpentine" belt?
And if it's a pulley needing to be replaced, which pulley?
Serpentine belt <-------------Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
I just talked to the parts store again and they say they can't get the pulley. (I still don't know which pulley it would be. Or more than one?) So if there's a burr, or some burrs, can't they just be filed away? I don't hear any rattling when the engine runs. Doesn't that mean it's not a bearing in a pulley?
That's the one. I can't get a pulley, apparently.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
ugh... first off the alternator pulley is held on by a NUT, not a BOLT.
I have no idea how it would get stripped. That's pretty tough to do without some chain vice grips and a big ass breaker bar.
Second, your in way over your skill set here... your going to make it worse, because you don't know what your doing.
Third, by the time you just take it to a mechanic and be done with it... you'll prolly be money up.
Fourth, youv'e been given all the information in the world on this matter. You just aren't going to get it without someone standing by your side to explain it as they go and you watching them do it. Maybe the mechanic you take it to will show some mercy and walk you back in the shop for a tutorial...
Good luck lady. :wave2:
Whatever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
What's tough to do?Quote:
I have no idea how it would get stripped. That's pretty tough to do without some chain vice grips and a big ass breaker bar.
Suzu - Its truly not clear what you are trying to say and lacking proper terminology isn't helping.
I cannot tell what is stripped, if you undid the pinch bolt before turning the wing nut, what pulley you are talking about (power steering idler?)
1) Do you have a manual?
If you are adamant about doing your own repairs, you will need it, it will explain SO much.
2) Do you have a camera?
Seeing exactly what "you" are looking at may clarify matters significantly, words can only do so much.
For example, the belt in question, your idea of frayed might be completely different from mine, but a picture would eliminate all the guessing
I have a manual but it seems to assume a lot of pre-existing knowledge. I look for how to do X and find that it says "do Y and Z first" while saying zilch about how Y and/or Z are done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntboot
I do have a camera and will take a pic of the alt. belt in a bit and post it.
Apparently I confused the "pinch bolt" with the one on the front of a small pulley that's right in front of the alternator. Nevertheless I was still able to tighten the wing nut (with some difficulty). Then when I went to re-tighten the bolt (or nut or whatever) that I had loosened just prior to moving the wing nut, it would not tighten back up. In fact I had found it already somewhat loose when I went to loosen it. I mentioned this to an auto parts guy, who told me that the apparently stripped bolt could be the cause of the belt fraying.
Does that help. Burntboot?
The nut that you loosened sounds like its for the power steering pump idler pulley.
It has nothing to do with the alternator.
For now, lets consider that a separate issue
Manuals are designed to be used by mechanics, so there is a certain "expectation of competency".
Whatever it is, the alternator belt wraps around it, so I would say that it has something to do with the alternator. If I am wrong, I'm glad to hear about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntboot
A picture would REALLY help here...Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
Yeah... I really don't feel like going out in the cold rain and wind to snap the pic right now. I will do it a.s.a.p. though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
I went out and took five pics of it from different angles. When I went to upload the pics from the camera, they had not been saved. I'll try again.
Sorry this took so long! The flash on the camera failed almost every time. Out of fifteen tries, these are the only decent ones I could get.
Attachment 9655
Attachment 9656
Now I suppose someone's going to tell me "That's not the alternator belt". LOL! That would mean I ordered the wrong part.
That's the alternator belt, and the alternator pulley.Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
Who stripped the pulley bolt?
I don't know. Plenty of people have worked on this car in the 33 years I've owned it. I know for sure it wasn't me. (p.s. I haven't always been as broke as I am now)Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
Is the belt "too frayed" to be safe?
Without being there to see it for myself... I can't know.
Since you know how to tighten/ loosen it now, why not just err on the side of caution and change it?
I ended up going to a repair shop. Here's what happened:
There was nothing stripped; the pulley was turning along with my wrench, apparently, and that's why I couldn't tighten the item (nut or bolt, I am now PERMANENTLY confused on that score). The pulley itself had an inward bend in it. I hadn't seen it before because it was not showing when I looked, it must have been on the bottom. But it could clearly be seen with the engine running. The mechanic said it must have been hit by a rock.
So I now have a new belt, and a pulley with a spot that was banged out by the mechanic so that it will no longer eat up the belt. If he made a mistake, I'll know soon enough. He had no trouble removing the bolt for the power steering belt adjustment. Maybe I wouldn't have had trouble with it if I had tried it again since the last time I sprayed it and banged on the nut.
I learned what I did not know before this visit to the mechanic: that the alternator pulley is PART OF the alternator.
Bottom line: I am another $140 in debt. Even before this expense there was already going to be no Thanksgiving or Christmas, and now there will be very little heat this winter. It's either that, or don't pay my property tax bill. I think I'd rather keep the house and be cold for the winter. At least I will be able to stay dry.
The really bad news is that my oil pan gasket needs replacing, and they tell me it's a big job, 3-4 hours' worth of big. Makes me wish I still lived where you could rent bays with lifts and do your own work.
:crickets:
Glad you got it fixed.
$140 in debt is never good, but having your ride usable = priceless
As for your oil pan, I would want to verify that is your leak.
The pan is does not have a "gasket" per say, it's installed with "form in place gasket".
The pan is only there to hold oil, there is no oil pressure exerted on that joint.
Also the static oil level is BELOW the pan flange (gasket surface) so all the more reason it rarely leaks from that spot.
Far more likely is a leak higher up, that just make it LOOK like the pan is leaking.
A can of engine shampoo (and a garden hose) will go a long way to helping you find what is exactly leaking.
30 years of seepage can look pretty nasty.
Rust can cause pans to leak but generally presents in a different manner
(wet oil spots underneath dry flaking rust)
The other part of the equation is how much is it leaking?
Oil leaks should NOT be ignored, but they do need to be evaluated to know wether it is urgent or can wait for better weather.
As for doing the pan, several threads already exist
-I did mine without a lift, so I imagine you could too.
I changed the oil in springtime of this year and had not checked it since. I don't drive very much, and this van doesn't "burn" oil. A month or so ago the dashboard oil warning light came on, so I checked and it was a quart low. I added a quart and checked underneath the car. There's oil all around the oil pan and especially on the side closest to the driver's seat. You're right, I should make sure of where the leak is. I just figured that on a car this old, the oil pan not-a-gasket is a likely culprit. The oil has gone down by 1/4 quart since I added oil. That's after driving well under 1k miles, maybe not even 500. (I don't log the dates and miles of everything I do to/with this van, and my memory is not what it used to be.) And oil is getting expensive!Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntboot
For the first 8 years that I owned the van, it lost half a quart of oil every 2,500 miles. Then one fine day my mechanic had it on a lift and happened to notice oil where it shouldn't be. This mechanic -- a Toyota freak working out of his own two-car garage which he had turned into the CLEANEST AND NEATEST auto shop you have ever seen (almost immaculate, and every bit as organized as an Auto Zone store) -- said it probably had come from the factory that way, because of where the leak was. And after he tightened that bolt, it never lost oil between oil changes, until now.
Is it really okay to shower the entire engine with a hose?Quote:
Originally Posted by Burntboot
So long as you don't get any water in the blinker fluid reservoir, and cover the flux capacitor you'll be fine...Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
Get some simple green and a paint brush and have at it.
:dance2:
I don't know what your motivation is with a post like this. I don't mind being belittled or whatever, but I really do lack the sort of smarts needed to understand such things. (not the mechanical stuff, but the snide remarks)Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
Suzu, if it's leaking while sitting still it could be the oil level sensor seal. This item is mounted to the driver side of the oil pan and is below the oil level(This is the part that turns on oil level light on the dash)meaning it could drip oil anytime whether running, driving, or sitting still. One of my vans is currently leaking here and it has gotten everywhere from the wind while driving. You definitely want to start with some cleaning to find the source. Maybe try cleaning from the top of the oil pan down to see of the leak is coming from above before spending a lot of time in the cold scrubbing down everything under the "hood".
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzu
It means, use simple green and a paint brush to clean the engine/ bay up and then hose it off....
Spray down the engine with simple green (or whatever your choice of degreaser is), then take the 1-1/2, 2" paint brush and use that to clean with. Work the degreaser in to help loosen up the grime and whatnot on the engine. Then use some water to clean off the muck.
After that it should be easier to spot any leaks.
Not to hard, really.
Also, I know what it is to live in cold conditions... our daytime high lately is 40*, night time low of 10*. I typically get used to it as winter goes on. I have 8" of snow on the ground right now. I get it...
The other thing you could do is hit the carwash and use the nozzle to spray off the underside, maybe pay a kid a fiver to see if he can do it.
Flecker, somehow I doubt the Simple Green part of your comment is the part she's having trouble with. Maybe it's time to walk away from this one before you get banned again......
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flecker
Thanks o! I don't see oil on the driveway. I think we have a few more days of 50+ weather coming up. That's good for me. I can get overheated when it's 60 out if I do enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by originalkwyjibo