Head gasket blew!

[timsrv]

At least it's not something that merits immediate action........I hope. I've been mysteriously losing coolant for about a year now, but it was very slow and I only needed to top off the recovery tank every couple months. I've looked for the leak several times, but could never make it leak while I was looking. I have a radiator pump and I've pressurized the system several times while looking for the leak, but the conditions were never right.

Well, about 2 weeks ago the radiator stopped sucking coolant from my recovery tank . I thoroughly checked the radiator cap, recovery tank, and the associated hoses but couldn't find anything wrong. This morning I noticed a spot of antifreeze on my garage floor when I left for work so tonight I checked it out again. Here's what I found:


Looks like it's leaking coolant out between the head & the block on the manifold side near the back of the engine. So far there isn't any coolant in my oil, oil in my coolant, no combustion gasses in my coolant, and no coolant entering my cylinders, but I do have a confirmed external leak. The van is an 89 Automatic Cargo 2wd with 162k miles on it. I carry a 3,000 lb fixed load and basically beat the crap out of it. I do maintain it pretty good though, so that helps equal things out. I'm not sure exactly when I'll do the job, I guess that will depend on the coolant consumption and how fast it gets worse. I'll post pics here and give details when I do. Tim

[slosurfer]

bummer, hopefully it lasts awhile. I know what it's like when your work vehicle goes down for major repairs, it sucks.

[timsrv]

Yeah, at least it made it through my busy season. Things should start slowing down here pretty soon. Hopefully it will make it til Christmas break and I'll do it then. Tim

[skyflyer9]

Wow, you really make that van work, don't you!

Hopefully it will give you the time you need before you get the chance to fix it...

[Sam Humans]

Pretty sure our 87 2wd LE w/140k is loosing coolant from the same area. It's definitely loosing it to the outside somewhere, as the oil has remained clean and I've been able to spot a little coolant running down the back of the block. Hopefully I will tackle this sometime in the next few months, so I would be super interested to see this thread completed. Word is your moving Tim so I know it'll be a while. Either way, hopefully I'll be able to add something of my own experience from a layman's perspective. I've rebuilt the heads on an old Ford truck, but never something as complex as the 4y.

What should I get done along the way? In other words, as long as it'll be torn apart, what basics should I inspect and/or preventatively take care of?

Thanks,
-Sam

[timsrv]

A more common place for these to leak is from the bypass hose on the back of the head (AKA "the hose of death"). All things considered, having a leak at that hose is much more likely than having it drip from the head gasket (like mine), so check that before getting too carried away with pulling the head. Here's a thread that addresses this: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...f-death-thread .

If the problem does end up being the head gasket (like mine), then you'll want to be sure and address other things while it's apart. When ever I pull the manifolds, I will always change out all the rubber parts and inspect the plastic injector connectors. There are several different hoses in the manifold area and they are all over 20 years old, so it's time. If you need to pull the head, let me know and I'll make a parts list for you. I plan on doing this anyhow (as this thread progresses), but if you need it before I get around to it just say the word and I'll post it sooner. I was going to change my head gasket on Christmas break, but I ended up goofing off in CA instead. So my van waits, & waits, & waits. It's still only leaking about a cup every week, so I just keep on putting more in and it keeps on going. Good luck on yours. Tim

[NEC]

I once had a turbo Mazda with the same problem, but it was also leaking combustion gasses into the cooling system and overflowing the radiator. I didn't have a lot to lose so I treated the engine with K&W Block Seal. I never had a problem with the head gasket again and drove around for the next two years with the head gasket set in the trunk. I was amazed by this stuff!! I'm not saying I endorse it or think it is a replacement for doing the job right, but it can help get you back on the road if you don't feel like doing the job right away.

[Sam Humans]

I once had a turbo Mazda with the same problem, but it was also leaking combustion gasses into the cooling system and overflowing the radiator.

Yup, that's exactly what's going on here. I should also have mentioned that we took it to a shop a few weeks ago and were told it had a blown head gasket, as there were exhaust gases in the coolant. Long story short, it overheated, put a new thermostat in it, now it drives around town but does not run as well as it did. And of course, there are no long drives in our future either, I don't think it would like that very much. Have very much considered some sort of stop leak, but everywhere I look people preach against it, add your positive review NEC, and the waters surrounding stop leak are increasingly muddy.

Would appreciate the parts list for sure Tim. Not in a big hurry (one thing I've learned is to take my time, get the right tools and parts, and not force anything!) but just want to get a budget together at this point so I can make a plan and start to move forward on this. Any recommendations for a good machine shop in the Portland/Vancouver area?

-S

[timsrv]

In that case it sounds like the head needs to come off anyhow. It will be a good time to take care of "the hose of death" along with several other things. Be sure to use a Genuine Toyota head gasket as many aftermarket gaskets just won't hold up well on the 4y.

As for machine work, over the years I've had a few bad experiences with "run of the mill" machine shops. Many of these places have the "good enough" attitude and the quality and attention to detail is lacking. I'm sure there are lots of good economy machine shops out there, but due to my experiences I will now only go to the shops that specialize in high performance. Quality work and attention to detail does take a little extra time, and for some procedures this extra effort will be reflected in price. If you plan on keeping this long term, then it's money well spent (as your equipment will last longer). I highly recommend Nutter Racing Engines off of 4th plain in the Orchards area of Vancouver, WA. AC is a good guy and his prices are surprisingly reasonable. Here's a link to his website: http://www.nutterracingengines.com/e..._services.html

[NEC]

I'm still not saying the block seal is the right way to fix it, but considering options and cost/time involved it might be worth a try. Here is a something to consider: the block seal process requires draining the cooling system, flushing it with clear water, applying the block seal, drying 24 hrs, re-flushing with clear water, and then re-filling with coolant. In my thought process this means you won't be left with a lot of junk floating around in your cooling system (and clogging things up) when you're done like other "stop leaks". It may not give you the same results I had but it would be worth a try if you need some time to get your finances in order for the big repair. I always planned on fixing my head gasket but never had any problems after the block seal treatment even with a lot of hard driving at 10psi boost.

Oh, and as far as machine work/etc. I agree with Tim, however, there is a guy on Ebay selling NEW, zero mile cylinder heads for our vans for $300.00 with a 5 yr warranty. I bought one after getting a crappy rebuilt one for only a few dollars less. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-T...Q5fAccessories

Plan on spending around 400.00 on all those air/water hoses that will be too old to re-use also.


re: horror stories: I too have heard all the horror stories about stop leak. My first job was in a machine shop, later in parts stores, and now in a Toyota dealership. If you use K&W Block Seal and follow the instructions on the can exactly you don't have much to lose. After all, it's already broken, right? If you continue driving in this condition you are eroding away your cylinder head at the compromised area and will eventually make for a head that is not rebuildable.

[timsrv]

I've used that stuff before too and it worked for me. I used it in my 81 Dodge D-50 truck with 250k miles on it. Those things would blow head gaskets if you looked at them cross-eyed anyhow and I had already done the job twice (wasn't about to do it again). At that point the entire truck was requiring too much maintenance and I needed something more dependable. I drove the truck for another 6 months or so until I found something else and I sold it for $700. It was still holding when the new owner drove it away and I saw that truck around until we moved (about a year or so later).

I wouldn't have a problem using that or any other similar products on a vehicle I considered "disposable". I won't put it in my cargo van though because I plan on keeping it forever. Besides, I have a $500 custom radiator and other cooling system mods I don't want to fowl up. I don't mind doing the head gasket so much because I like to take it apart every so often to inspect and perform preventive maintenance. Of course this van is my livelihood and I need it to be reliable . Tim