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Thread: Standard to LE (add tach) and LE to standard cluster swaps

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    Standard to LE (add tach) and LE to standard cluster swaps

    So I've come across an le van cluster with a tac... My cargo has no tac and was planning on installing an aftermarket gauge. But I'd think it be cleaner to install an le cluster with the tac. Before I tear into this ADDED project I'd like to know if it's even possible to wire this up. Any help is appreciated!

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    Re: le cluster swap

    Not only is it possible it is relatively simple to do.
    First, throw away the manual on this one, go by the notes on the printed circuit board itself.
    (I had several packs on hand, but even the one in the vehicle didn't match up to what my wiring diagram said it should be)
    Several wires need to move from this plug to that one. I made a chart of the 2 separate packs and then did a one wire at a time change and crossed off the changes on the diagrams as I went, seemed like a waste of time until the first interruption, by the 6th interruption I was really glad I "wasted" the time making the diagrams as I never would have been able to accomplish what I had set out to do, without the backup notes.

    I would also highly recommend cleaning the pack while its apart and replacing all the bulbs. I didn't bother doing the LED upgrade and am happy with the factory lighting, with a clean pack and new bulbs, I actually have to turn the dimmer down a bit.
    BB

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    Re: le cluster swap

    Cool, thank you! When I get around to doing it maybe I'll do a write up.

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    Forum Newbie samtrak's Avatar
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    Re: le cluster swap

    update to this?

    the camry of the same era was a plug and play swap for the whole gauge cluster. wouldn't it be nice if things were so easy?

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    Intrument cluster swap

    I have an instrument cluster from an early 1985 LE with a tach and was wondering if it will work in my 1986 cargo van by just changing pins in the plugs

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    Re: Intrument cluster swap

    I went the other way, from a 87 tach cluster into my 84 DX. I changed pins to correct positions, had to find rpm wire going to computer, splice and run a new wire for tach signal (found the wire going to the computer under drivers footrest near left footwell), finally change oil pressure warning light sensor to different one that outputs for the pressure gauge. There may have been a different type connection that need to be spliced for the pressure sensor, can't remember. Good luck.

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    Van Enthusiast bikerjosh's Avatar
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    Re: le cluster swap

    Quick question, as I get ready to swap out my cargo non-tach cluster with an LE one. The only connection I was scratching my head about is one labeled "IIA" integrated ignition assembly, I'm assuming this is the wiring coming from the distributer for the tach signal, but wanted to check before I tear into this?
    thanks

    edit: yes, IIA is the pin for tach siginsl wire.
    Last edited by bikerjosh; 05-14-2017 at 11:03 AM.
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    Re: le cluster swap

    so, how many wires are we talking about? is this a full day job?

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    Re: le cluster swap

    Its been a long time since I did mine but I remember it being a pita, mostly because nothing lined up with the manual and its REALLY hard to read the circuit board and I took my time and I never seem to be able to do just one thing straight thru without a distraction or 20.

    I would think that a normal person could git er done in a couple/few hours though.

    Maybe 1/2 doz wires need relocating and you gotta run a new wire to the dizzy.
    Oh and then theres the new oil pressure sender in place of the OP switch and run another wire for that.

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    Van Enthusiast boogieman's Avatar
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    Re: le cluster swap

    started making diagrams to get this going but realized i may have an issue, my van is an 87 4x4 manual and the cluster is from an 89 2wd auto...question, do the speedos have the same ratio? i know ill lose my 4wd light, but thought maybe id wire it thru the o/d light..

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    Re: le cluster swap

    Quote Originally Posted by boogieman View Post
    started making diagrams to get this going but realized i may have an issue, my van is an 87 4x4 manual and the cluster is from an 89 2wd auto...question, do the speedos have the same ratio? i know ill lose my 4wd light, but thought maybe id wire it thru the o/d light..
    You shouldn't have any problem with the speedo. As far as hooking up the overdrive light to 4wd, that is a good id.
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    Re: le cluster swap

    so the speedos all have the same ratio? also, i dont have a IIA connection on my le LE cluster, im curious where its getting the tach signal, i do have an ig+ and ig-....oil pressure gauge will use same wire as idiot light, so no need to run another wire there..

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    Re: le cluster swap

    I put an auto inst pack into my std and haven't noticed a difference, speedo is accurate with 205/70r15's

    You have to run a wire from the dizzy to the pack for the tack signal. Its been a long time but I seem to remember having trouble finding IIA, I think it ended up being labelled differently on the circuit board, wish I could remember

    That oil pressure gauge is not compatible with the non-LE sender, non-LE's use a common wire/idiot light for level and pressure and it is only looking for signal (on/off)
    The proper LE style sender is required and a new wire too, as the gauge is looking for a range of signal.
    The old wiring will still be utilized for the level sensor which now gets it's very own idiot light
    I just taped off the old wiring at the sender, in case I ever need to swap it back.
    BB

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    Actually it isn't bad at all. Once you get the hang of releasing the clips that hold the individual wires in the harness plugs. I have a cross over diagram a made showing what wires move from which plug to the other plug. Used my 87' FSM and a little trial and error to make it. I did this from a 4wd cargo 5spd, with a clock cluster into a 4wd LE cluster from an auto van. Tach hook up is easy one new wire to run from engine to cluster.
    After I made the swap, I found a 4wd 5spd LE cluster, that I have yet to swap in, so my LE 4wd autotrans cluster w/tach will be for sale soon.
    I'll dig around for my chicken scratch diagram tonight when I get home.
    Josh
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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    Quote Originally Posted by bikerjosh View Post
    Actually it isn't bad at all. Once you get the hang of releasing the clips that hold the individual wires in the harness plugs. I have a cross over diagram a made showing what wires move from which plug to the other plug. Used my 87' FSM and a little trial and error to make it. I did this from a 4wd cargo 5spd, with a clock cluster into a 4wd LE cluster from an auto van. Tach hook up is easy one new wire to run from engine to cluster.
    After I made the swap, I found a 4wd 5spd LE cluster, that I have yet to swap in, so my LE 4wd autotrans cluster w/tach will be for sale soon.
    I'll dig around for my chicken scratch diagram tonight when I get home.
    Josh
    Hi Josh, We recently chatted over on Expeditionportal.

    I thought (for some reason) the stock tach worked from a cable. If its wired, that should easier. If you can share the crossover that diagram that would be really helpful! There is a cluster with a tach on ebay right now for $45 plus $21 shipping. Im not sure if that's a good deal or not.

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    SS - you have to be careful with a cross-over diagram, while it may well be just the ticket, it may also cause immense grief.

    When I did mine I had several clusters on hand and no 2 clusters were identical.

    Also be aware that the oil pressure/level circuits are different:
    Clusters without a tach have 1 idiot light that is shared for both level and pressure
    The pressure sender is basically on on/off switch

    Tach clusters have the idiot light only for level, but have a gauge that displays pressure and requires a variable signal to accurately display.

    Making it all work as the factory intended means installing the proper oil pressure sender and running a new wire up to the pack.
    It isn't hard to do, and the sender is close to the distributor, where you will tag in for the RPM signal, so the 2 wires can be run at the same time.

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    Is it a 4wd cluster, or having the 4wd light? Not sure I think I paid 35-40 from the PnP pin Stockton, CA for mine. Iíll have to look for the diagram tomorrow, sucked into yard work.
    Quote Originally Posted by ShapeShifter View Post
    Hi Josh, We recently chatted over on Expeditionportal.

    I thought (for some reason) the stock tach worked from a cable. If its wired, that should easier. If you can share the crossover that diagram that would be really helpful! There is a cluster with a tach on ebay right now for $45 plus $21 shipping. Im not sure if that's a good deal or not.
    1987 4wd 5spd Cargo van (uncut)-modding in 3,2,1

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    Full disclosure I didnít hook up the oil pressure gauge other than to the idiot light since I have aftermarket oil pres,water temp and volt digital gauges.
    My oem oil temp gauge goes through random cycles from top of gauge to bottom periodically hanging out at one extreme or another. I think it might be reading biorhythms now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Burntboot View Post
    SS - you have to be careful with a cross-over diagram, while it may well be just the ticket, it may also cause immense grief.

    When I did mine I had several clusters on hand and no 2 clusters were identical.

    Also be aware that the oil pressure/level circuits are different:
    Clusters without a tach have 1 idiot light that is shared for both level and pressure
    The pressure sender is basically on on/off switch

    Tach clusters have the idiot light only for level, but have a gauge that displays pressure and requires a variable signal to accurately display.

    Making it all work as the factory intended means installing the proper oil pressure sender and running a new wire up to the pack.
    It isn't hard to do, and the sender is close to the distributor, where you will tag in for the RPM signal, so the 2 wires can be run at the same time.
    1987 4wd 5spd Cargo van (uncut)-modding in 3,2,1

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    I ended up using a cluster from an auto & 4WD van.

    The auto cluster has a light for overdrive, another for trans temp, and I can't remember what other differences.
    The wiring diagram in the manual didn't match up to any of the packs I had on hand, including the one it was born with and should be the same as my manual, but no.


    With both packs in front of you, make a diagram of the connectors on the circuit board, every one is marked
    It was a long time ago but I think in the end, I only moved 5 or 6 wires and all were long enough to reach their new locations.
    BJ is right about releasing the locks, they are a pain but once past that hurdle its pretty straight forward.

    I would assume that a 2wd pack would work, you just wouldn't have a 4WD indicator light (circuit).
    And in that case, you might be able to repurpose another unused idiot light in the pack, to work in its place.
    But I would resist the urge to make modifications before getting the rest of it sorted and functional.

    Its really not hard to rig the O/P gauge and unless you have auxiliary gauges, I would highly recommend making sure to get that part sorted out.
    I also really like the idea of the separated functionality, rather than having just one light for both level and pressure.

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    Re: Tachometer Upgrade?

    Here is the diagram I PM'd you about. Name:  wiring gauge.jpg
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