Horrible overheating issue

[Polrber244]

Hello TVT!!! Thanks for what everyone does to help keep our vans rollin.

Ok...I replaced fan clutch, t-stat, and water pump with all OEM parts yet my van still overheats with 6-8 miles of driving. Idling in my driveway the van's temp needle will hover around 50%. If I take the van out for a drive, I am lucky to get 8 miles before the van hits about 85% on the temp needle. The overflow container begins to violently bubble so loud I can hear it before popping the hood.

I am starting to wonder if Im having a partial HG failure that shows itself once the van gets hot (expands) showing holes that are non-existant at lower temps or if the extra comprssion from accelerating is pushing the compression gases into my water jackets.I have seen none of the typical signs of a full blown HG but Im lost as to what else to do with my Yota Beast.

Any insight would be wonderful. Thanks.

Im gettin a beer to help with my brainstormin and mostly my sanity

[timsrv]

Welcome to the site. We just had a discussion about cooling issues. Here is a link to that thread: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...rom-Vancouver-!

Much of what was outlined there applies to you. I didn't discuss head gaskets (that was part of the 10% I didn't discuss) but it is a possibility. Does any coolant blow out your overflow before the temp gauge hits 75%? Does it lose any coolant other than when it overheats? Is there white smoke coming from the exhaust? Can you smell antifreeze at the exhaust when the van is running?

Pull your spark plugs and inspect the electrode areas. They should all appear the same. If you have one that's noticeably different (beat-up looking and/or super clean), that's an indication of a mildly blown head gasket at that cylinder. Tim

[Polrber244]

Welcome to the site. We just had a discussion about cooling issues. Here is a link to that thread: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...rom-Vancouver-!

Much of what was outlined there applies to you. I didn't discuss head gaskets (that was part of the 10% I didn't discuss) but it is a possibility. Does any coolant blow out your overflow before the temp gauge hits 75%? Does it lose any coolant other than when it overheats? Is there white smoke coming from the exhaust? Can you smell antifreeze at the exhaust when the van is running?

Pull your spark plugs and inspect the electrode areas. They should all appear the same. If you have one that's noticeably different (beat-up looking and/or super clean), that's an indication of a mildly blown head gasket at that cylinder. Tim

Thanks for the fast reply Tim.
The temp needle can be at 50% and I will have a rumbling in the overflow that will drain it dry. It doesnt seem like the van needs to overheat to blow coolant into the overflow. I havent noticed any other coolant loss yet ,but, tonight I did hear some liquid that sounded as if it was coming out of the hose of death area( time to cut an access ) I also noticed my heater blows cool and I do get an occasional puff of white smoke from the exhaust upon start up.

I will def check the electrode areas tomorrow as well as cut an access to the hose of death.

Thanks Tim. From the posts Ive read from you. I decided to buy as much yota OEM stuff I can get. Take for instance my water pump. Brand new aftermarket pump from napa was $40. The OEM pump from the yota dealer here in town $54....wasnt a hard decision to buy yota's pump.

[timsrv]

If it's blowing coolant out the overflow at 50% of temp then that sounds like a bad head gasket. Pulling plugs and checking electrodes should confirm this. If the plug inspection is inconclusive you could use a sniffer to look for exhaust gas in the cooling system. An auto repair shop can do this for a fee or you could purchase a kit from Napa and do it yourself.

I just did another "hose of death" last weekend and took some more pics. I'm posting them to the "Hose of death" thread now. Here's a link: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...=2244#post2244 Tim

[theschnell]

I doubt this would be the problem, but you should always start with the easy stuff first. Make sure you have a new rad cap. If your cap isn't holding in pressure, that will work against you.

[theschnell]

Oh, and I forgot to add, make sure your radiator is ok. I could drive my van at low speeds, say below 45mph, and it was fine, but as soon as I went faster it got really hot. I had the radiator recored, and saw vast improvement. Now I may just need a new fan clutch in order to be able to drive 75 or 80, but even when I do that I'm probably only at 60% right now.

[EZHIKER]

Sure sounds like a BHG

[Polrber244]

Thanks for the responses everyone

I've decided to go ahead with replacement of the head gasket along with my cracked exhaust manifold. I am also pulling the radiator to have it recored but was wondering.

Should I buy the parts to install the e-fan upgrade since Im going to have the yota torn down anyways? And also. Im not a big fan of A/C so I was thinking of removing its components. Is it worth the time?

[timsrv]

If you don't think you'll ever want AC, then yes, it's worth getting it out of there. I wouldn't worry about the evaporator(s), but I'd pull the condenser(s) and the compressor out. This will allow for better ventilation to the front of your radiator and it would be nice to drop the extra lbs.

As for switching to electric fans there are pros and cons to either way you go. A correctly functioning clutch fan will move more air at high RPMs, but the engine also works harder generating more heat while doing so. The beauty of the electric fan set-up is it will cool at maximum rate while your engine is at rest. To me that's the clincher that sells me on electric. Of course there's a down-side. An electric fan set-up will increase the load on an already fragile alternator.........and if the alternator fails.........battery goes dead quickly...........and no more electric fan.........or anything else (bad). It sucks when that happens.

Most of the time when you develop a cooling system problem it's a common failure like an internally clogged up radiator, debris blocking airflow through radiator, fan clutch failure, bad thermostat, cooling system leak, bad radiator cap, etc, etc, etc). Fortunately, all is fine again once found and resolved.

Another possibility is to leave the clutch fan and install an electric pusher fan in front of the radiator. I put a single 15" pusher there on my 86. It stays off most of the time but I turn it on while running the AC on a hot day. An added plus is it could be rigged up to a t-stat (like shown below) for automatic operation while it's needed. If you wire it to a battery circuit (on while ignition is off) it will keep the engine compartment cool after shut-down and will prevent the "hot soak" problem from occurring.

If you decide to go completely electric, here's my home made fan shroud project that I installed on my 89 cargo van. Flex-a-Lite makes a universal kit with shroud included, but I much prefer the perfect fit of a custom unit.

The shroud is made of 22 ga galvanized sheet metal and soldered at the seams with 50/50 solder. It is made to perfectly fit (2) 10" electric fans. Here it is before cutting out the fan holes. Note: There's a relief in the lower left so there's room to run the transmission cooler hose.




An internet search revealed that the "S-blade" style fans move the most air and are also the quietest. For these reasons I ended up going with this style fan. These are rated at 1900 cfm @ 6.8 amps each (the highest CFM available for 10" fans).




To get direct contact with coolant (for best temp control) I removed the plug that was in the head (marked extra unused port).


The adjustable thermostat I'm using to make my fans turn off and on is a capillary type with a 1/4" sensor probe on the end. To make the transition from the 1/4" sensor to 16mm X 1.5 pitch threads (the size of the extra unused port), I purchased a brass adaptor at the local hardware store. It originally was 3/8"mpt on one end and 1/4" compression on the other (these are readily available). I also purchased a 16mm X 1.5 die and simply chased the slightly larger 3/8" threads to convert to metric. The larger size 3/8 pipe thread was almost too big to chase without turning in a lathe, but with a little effort and patience this can be done by hand with only a vice and hand threading tools. After chasing, the new metric threads are perfect. You cannot even tell it was ever a standard 3/8 pipe thread :P . See the t-stat and modified brass adaptor below:


Here is the brass adaptor and the probe installed into the extra unused port.


And here is the completed project.




I have been driving this for almost 3 years and I'm happy with the performance.

[Polrber244]

Tim...that is one clean engine. Your shroud and e-fan set-up is sweet. Kudos!

I think I will go with the pusher fan recommendation since I just replaced the fan clutch. I like the idea of having it run while the engine is off so that is a must.

I will also be removing the A/C. I live in the south but oh well, the ocean breeze is nice, the van will be happier, and I can hang my arm out of the window

There was a post written, Im almost positive by Tim, which mentioned the purchase of these parts for an easier life:

Toyota Part Number
Studs
-90116-10058 Qty:3
-92122-40610 Qty:6
-90116-08128 Qty:2

Nuts

-90179-10070 Qty:3
-90179-06194 Qty:6
-90179-08059 Qty:2

I have read sooooo many thread/topics lately they are starting to blur together lol.

What were these parts for Tim?

I'm going to replace my exhaust manifold too so I'm interested in purchasing these if they will make this head gasket/exhaust manifold replacement easier.

Thank you much Tim

[timsrv]

Your new manifold will arrive as the casting only. No studs or nuts are included. You will need to remove the heat shield from the old one and transfer to the new. The 6 studs and nuts that hold it on will almost certainly break off when you remove it. Then there are the 2 studs and nuts that hold on the o2 sensor/plate, then there's the 3 studs and nuts that hold the down-pipe to the manifold. Even if you are successful in removing the old studs and nuts I wouldn't recommend re-using them because they lose strength over time due to the severe service of these locations. Tim

[Polrber244]

Your new manifold will arrive as the casting only. No studs or nuts are included. You will need to remove the heat shield from the old one and transfer to the new. The 6 studs and nuts that hold it on will almost certainly break off when you remove it. Then there are the 2 studs and nuts that hold on the o2 sensor/plate, then there's the 3 studs and nuts that hold the down-pipe to the manifold. Even if you are successful in removing the old studs and nuts I wouldn't recommend re-using them because they lose strength over time due to the severe service of these locations. Tim

Thanks for the insight.
Im going to take your advice and buy those parts, it would be silly not to based on your conclusions...it just makes sense.

Sorry if I got a bit off-topic...my van needs a lot of TLC

[Polrber244]

Here is a pic of my blown head gasket.

[timsrv]

Looks like you made the right call. That thing is blown bad. I'm surprised you didn't see a bunch of coolant leaking down the back of your engine block. Tim

[Polrber244]

Looks like you made the right call. That thing is blown bad. I'm surprised you didn't see a bunch of coolant leaking down the back of your engine block. Tim

At first I thought the "hose of death" was where my coolant was coming from on the back side of the engine. I replaced the hose and coolant came out in a stream right where my head gasket had failed. So far the block and head look good

[The hermit]

could I use that port for an aftermarket temp gauge? How did you remove the plug from the engine(looks like an allenwrench)

[timsrv]

Yes, this would be a good place for an aftermarket temp gauge. Due to the length from the engine to the dash I would recommend going with an electric gauge. They are a bit more expensive, but it's a lot easier running a wire than running a capillary tube with a bulb (and you're not limited by a pre-set length). If I remember right you'll need an 8mm allen wrench and a bit of luck to get that plug out (they can get stuck in there good). The thread size is 16mm X 1.5 pitch, so you'll need a sending unit with these threads or a suitable adapter to make the transition. Tim

[The hermit]

I figured the plug would be seized ill soak it w/liquidwrench. Im planning to cut new threads on a3/8"adapter where should look for a 16/1.5 die? Thankyou so much!

[timsrv]

Dies can be found many places including Amazon. My thermostat was a special case because it was a capillary tube type and that type of compression adapter was not readily available. An electric sending unit will most likely be threaded and adapters for those should be much easier to find. As long as you are purchasing an electric temperature gauge, it will likely come with the required bushing/adapter. If not, most performance oriented auto parts stores will have the correct adapters in stock. Even Napa should have the right one for the job. Tim

FWIW, the brass fitting you see in the lower left position (where the OD thermo switch should be) is the sending unit for my aftermarket electric temperature gauge. This port is also 16mm X 1.5 pitch and the adapter I needed came with the gauge kit.

[Beatrice87]

If it's blowing coolant out the overflow at 50% of temp then that sounds like a bad head gasket. Pulling plugs and checking electrodes should confirm this. If the plug inspection is inconclusive you could use a sniffer to look for exhaust gas in the cooling system. An auto repair shop can do this for a fee or you could purchase a kit from Napa and do it yourself.

I just did another "hose of death" last weekend and took some more pics. I'm posting them to the "Hose of death" thread now. Here's a link: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...=2244#post2244 Tim

Hello all, I've got similar happenings with my 87' that I'm hoping you can give me some insight on. I'm able to drive it around the city with literally no issue, coolant does it's thing; pushes into the overflow then sucks back into the radiator after cooling down. However, after driving for about 2 hours (temp stays right where it should) coolant will start pushing out of the overflow and onto the ground. Not until the radiator gets low on coolant will the temp start climbing.

So I started by replacing the radiator cap and all hose between my neck and overflow tank. Coolant looks clean peering into it. It passed a combustion test although I do see small bubbles peering into the neck while running and revving. Just checked my plugs and they look as they should. No white smoke or coolant smells coming from the exhaust. Put a temp gun on the radiator and hoses to check for inconsistent temp, but all was good.

I'm convinced it's head or gasket related and I'll gladly do the job, but just want to be sure and rule out any other possibilities. Thx in advance! Jared