Replacing Fuel Injector(s)

[Spindrift]

I have had my van for about a week. I was smelling fuel so I called the previous owner and he says; "You didn't fill it up did you?" I said "Yes, remember it was below empty when I got it?" He was trying to tell me you never fill a van because the tank runs length wise. - Whatever, I realized I was on my own. Lifted the cover and noticed gas coming from the 2nd injector. Took a picture and sent it to our family mechanic and he says "At least 600.00 to fix." So here I am. I only paid 900.00 and expected I would be dealing with some of this. I have rebuilt motorcycles but id say the most I have ever done to a car was replace a thermostat. This is a little scary. After seeing some of Tim's posts and seeing various parts disassembled though I feel a little empowered so I began taking stuff apart. I think I have almost every hose off except for the banjo fitting on this (what I believe is a pressure regulator).

My first Question:
This thing looks like it is a booger to get off and it scares me a little. It looks like the banjo part is part of the nut. My question is... Is that banjo part connected to the nut part? If so how in the world do you get it off? Is there anything I need to be careful about?

Question 2:
I told my mechanic about "Dr. Injector" that is supposed to be a whiz in the Portland area for fixing injectors. My mechanic says "Don't do it. Get new or you will be sorry." I am all for saving money but not if I have to do this again. I would love to get some advice on this matter. If others have used "Dr. Injector" I would love to hear more. If you have bought new injectors which do you recommend? I am clueless here and more than a little nervous. I see injectors listed from 35.00 to 235.00 and I am not sure what is what.

On a side note. People complain about engine access on these and what a roflroflroflroflrofl it is to work on them but I have found a lot of bonuses to this. For one I am not breaking my back leaning into the engine compartment. I have a nice little seat (out of the rain... a bonus for Portland) and you hardly have to reach for anything. Getting to the back goodies is a bummer but I cut a couple of access holes after studying the "Hose of Death" thread and now that part is easy too. All and all I like it. Even with the trouble I have already I am in love with this thing. I really want to figure this thing out because I see it as a perfect vehicle for me. Hopefully after this chapter we will have many happy times together.

Any and all help much appreciated.

BTW
I also included a photo before I cut some holes. I modified them a little but basically the black square on the right is from the "Hose of Death" thread (thanks Tim) and the pink highlighter is my own creation to get to some of the bits I could not reach. Tim must have arms like Houdini. I would have driven myself mad trying to get these bits on the left. I will show the final hack in another post. I used a Dremel and about 7 blades to do this so I would recommend using the little saws all Tim had if you have one.

[timsrv]

Hi and welcome to TVT! That fuel component in your 1st picture is the pulsation damper. It is incorporated into the bolt that passes through the banjo fitting. To get it off use a 22mm or a 7/8" wrench (it's okay to interchange standard tools on some of the bigger fasteners). To help you get a better grasp on how it fastens, here's a picture of one that's not installed:



These have a tendency to develop leaks and start fires, so if you're removing it and don't know the history I would recommend replacing it. It's Toyota part #23270-50011. If you want genuine Toyota (recommended) it's current MSRP is $94.70 but it can be had for ~$70 if you purchase from one of those discount Toyota parts sites like www.toyotapartsdeal.com. I'm currently running a Standard Motor Products (SMP) part #FPD4 damper that I purchased from www.rockauto.com for $37.79 and so far it's been solid.

Toyota's injectors rarely fail, but these vans are getting old so we're beginning to see issues here. My personal opinion is a good used Toyota injector is probably just as good as (perhaps better than) a rebuilt injector from who knows where, so if you're injectors test good then I'd keep using them. I would however strongly recommend having them cleaned and tested before putting them back into service. I'm assuming you saw my recent post about Dr. Injector in Gladstone, but for anybody else that might be interested here's a link: https://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/...ng-Head-Gasket (scroll down to post #15). Tim

[timsrv]

Here's another thread that may help you with your fuel system issues: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...sure-regulator

[Spindrift]

Thanks Tim! That is probably a good call. Could a bad pulsation dampener cause the injector blowout/failure? Something is seriously blown in that #2 because gas is pouring out big time. I worry is that old plastic might pass the test but fail later (like #2 did) just because it is old plastic.

I guess I will probably go check out the Dr. and get his opinion on the old plastic.

Question1:
It looks like my hose(s) of death have been replaced but I still need to remove them to get the manifold off and the fuel rail right?

Question 2:
Will the injectors just pop out when I get the manifold/fuel rail off?

[timsrv]

Wayne at Dr. Injector knows his stuff. If he says you can run the injector then you can run it. If it's bad or marginal he'll tell you. Pulling the top half of the manifold is somewhat of a PITA. Yes, you will want to pull the hose of death to separate. You will also need to pull the EGR valve and modulator off. The cold start injector tube will need to be removed as well. There are some other hoses/tubes & associated fasteners that will need to be removed too. After you get the obvious stuff, lift, wiggle, and probe for the rest. Once the top half is removed you will want to remove the fuel return line from the FPR (Fuel Pressure Regulator) and remove the injector connectors. After that there's just 2 bolts that hold the fuel rail on. Remove those and the fuel rail will pull right off. The only thing holding the injectors in place is their o-rings between the manifold and the fuel rail. They will either pull off with the fuel rail or stay in the manifold. Either way it's just a tug and a twist to finish removing them (after the rail has been removed).

One thing to watch out for is old seal material or debris left in the injector mount holes. If you install injectors with debris in there you will likely create a leak and/or damage the rail and/or the injectors. Just make sure everything is clean and use a small amount of petroleum based grease to pre-lube the isolators/o-rings before assembly. Tim

[timsrv]

The only thing the pulsation damper does is smooth out the pulsations created by the fuel pump. There's basically just a diaphragm with a spring in there. From the perspective of dampening pulsations, they never fail. Failure occurs when the diaphragm tears and fuel starts leaking all over your hot exhaust manifold .

[llamavan]

My first Question:
This thing looks like it is a booger to get off and it scares me a little. It looks like the banjo part is part of the nut. My question is... Is that banjo part connected to the nut part? If so how in the world do you get it off? Is there anything I need to be careful about?

HERE is the tutorial for replacing the fuel pulsation damper only.

Gwen

[Spindrift]

You have me sold on the good doctor Tim. I know I will catch hell from my girlfriends mechanic (who is a friend also) but the Dr sounds way cheaper and I trust you both have much more experience with this. I hope to have the manifold off today or tomorrow. I think I will try to clean everything up as well as I can so I can become more familiar with it and to better trace leaks and such later. I also want to replace all of the rubber. I think I will even replace the replaced "Hose of Death" just to have it all fresh. Rubber is cheap and I am here.

Maybe I will replace the valve cover gasket too. Does that need to be OEM also?

I will be taking the injectors to the doctor Monday and see how long it takes. Can't wait to get this back together. I was just about to start building a bench/bed when I launched into this. Looking forward to smelling like wood instead of gas.

Do I just take the injectors only to the doctor?

[Spindrift]

Thanks for the tutorial Gwen!

[timsrv]

Maybe I will replace the valve cover gasket too. Does that need to be OEM also?

I will be taking the injectors to the doctor Monday and see how long it takes. Can't wait to get this back together. I was just about to start building a bench/bed when I launched into this. Looking forward to smelling like wood instead of gas.

Do I just take the injectors only to the doctor?

I typically buy enough parts through Toyota that I get the VC gaskets there too (more for convenience reasons than anything). Rockauto.com was having a close-out on the Beck Arnley VC gaskets a few months ago for $.80 each so I got a dozen of them. I installed the 1st one a couple months ago & didn't see anything wrong with it. It fit nice and it sealed up fine. I probably won't buy anymore Toyota VC gaskets until I use these ones up...........unless a problem arises, but I sort of doubt that will happen.

Just take Wayne the injectors. If you have suspicions about any of your other fuel system parts you may want to bring them along just in case. I know he offers other services there and may be able to help with other issues. It will only take him 1/2 hr or less to do all 4 injectors. Assuming he's not tied up with anything else he'll likely take you back to watch the process. If there's a problem he'll point it out so you can see for yourself. If you need another injector I'm guessing he'll have it for a reasonable price. He's got bins & bins of injectors and repair parts at his fingertips. I feel like a kid in a candy store when I go there . Tim

[Spindrift]

Thanks Tim! I usually don't like to go to the doctor I am really looking forward to this visit!

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  Can't wait to get the old girl on the road again!
  
  

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[Spindrift]

I finally got my manifold off today (!) and have been looking over the rubber. I am assuming that the hoses with factory clamps is probably original equipment. Both of the "Hoses of Death" look like they were replaced but if this is cheap I might as well put fresh rubber on. This looks like pretty standard get anywhere hose right?

Here is a look underside the manifold where things seem a little crunchier.

I should have asked this before. Is there an online microfiche type thing where I can identify parts and get part numbers? I have a lot more questions now. What is this stuff?

(1) Do I need to replace this gasket?

(2, 3, 4) These are pretty hard. Should I replace and if so can I get this hose anywhere?

(5) This hose cracked it was so brittle. I think I have seen this hose at the parts store. I have extra gas line hose but it says "Do not use for fuel injection" or something like that. I guess that is a pressure thing? This cracked hose will appear in the next two shots also.

(6) This hose is brittle. If it is not a high pressure or super critical maybe I can let it slide? It looks like it must be from Toyota with all the fancy manufactured bends. Right? Probably spendy.

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This next picture is just to remind me to get lots of these little brass washers.

(1) Do I need a special part number or can I just take them into the auto parts store and get the same size?

(2) How hard do I torque the little brass washers?

note: there's that cracked hose again

And finally here is my pressure damper. Looks ancient. I guess originally it had a screw in that little hole from what I read in another thread. I am going to hold off ordering this and see if maybe the doctor knows where to get one tomorrow.

(and there is mr. cracked hose again

)

[timsrv]

Nice job! This thread should help: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...=2052#post2052

[Spindrift]

Thanks Tim! So I gather you WOULD replace ALL of the rubber. Correct?

[timsrv]

Yes..........unless you feel like splitting the manifold again in 2 or 3 years to replace just one or 2 of them . Assuming that's original rubber I'd say now is a good time. Tim

[Spindrift]

Yeah. Not so much. I will take your advice. Almost ready to go to the Dr. Keep you posted.

[Spindrift]

Where do I find the part # for the intake gasket?

Also the little brass washers that go with the banjo joints... I can get those anywhere right? I ordered the BIG ones for the pulsation damper because I had the #'s and I thought they might be slightly harder to find.

PS. Dr. Injector says my injectors had horrible spray patterns, two leaked and all had low flow. He has my injectors rebuilt and hopefully I will be getting all of my new on-line rubber before the weekend.

Thank you ALL for the help!

[Spindrift]

... or whatever the name of this gasket is.

[timsrv]

That gasket is not interchangeable from 3y to 4y, so in your case (3y) you'll want Toyota part #17176-73010. I'm sure it's also available aftermarket. If you go that route be sure to specify it's a 3y. It's called a "surge tank gasket". The little copper washers are Toyota part #90430-08005. If you like the ones with the little tab sticking out those are part #90430-08007. These are common parts so I suspect if you walked into any auto parts store and showed them one they could easily match them up. Tim

[Spindrift]

Thanks Tim! What does 3Y 4Y mean? I keep seeing that and you'd think I would have figured it out by now. I originally thought these were the same engines used in the trucks from the same time but I hear this is a entirely different creature yes? Like some sort of forklift engine. Can you point me to more info on this?