Another overheating issue, searched but need insight

[Jlhollowx13]

Hi all, I just purchased a 1988 4x4. It had a new water pump and radiator installed but the po left the fan shroud off. I drove it home and had to go over a few passes. On the last and worst pass I had to pull over and let it cool down. I figured the shroud was the problem so I installed it when I got home. Funny thing is the shroud was hitting the fan and the bottom of the shroud is in interference with the front axle. I made it work, but it seemed to have a lot of gaps around but I figured it should be fine. We went on a short trip and had to climb some long but semi gradual hills. Had to pull over a lot even with the shroud on. Van was running slightly over half going 65 on flat ground,rose slightly on most uphills.

I've done my research and the thermostat isn't oem but is new, so replacing that with new oem. Also I'm not getting the roar from the fa like everyone talks about, so replacing that as well.

My real quandary is this however, I only have my 2wd to compare it to, the 2 seems to roar when cold if I rev it up to about 1500 to 2000 rpm, don't really wanna go anymore than that. I drove the 2 the same trip and was not trying to be easy over the passes so that I could assess the condition of the cooling system and it didn't flinch, so I think its all good there and something I can compare to. But upon inspection of the shroud and radiator placement on both vehicles I realized they are sitting in very different spots. In the 2 the radiator is situated closer to the engine and the shroud is up against it and also enclosing the fan much more. There seems to also be something in front of the radiator, like an ac condenser or something but I don't know for sure, this does not exist on my 4wd, the radiator seems to sit more forward where that condenser thing is. This also causes the shroud to not be able to fit over the radiator correctly and in turn not surround the fan as well. I just don't get it as The radiator seems solidly supported which makes me think it's in the right place, but all I have to compare the 4x4 5 speed to is the 2wd automatic. The 4x4 does have a radiator from an automatic though. I've included some pictures to help illustrate but any help is appreciated! I just don't know if it's supposed to be different or not with the different models or how I can move it as I don't see any other supports.

Again, thanks for any help, I'm stumped. Usually you can tell where a part should go, especially a radiator!

[Jlhollowx13]

Sorry don't know why the photos are upside down! Also, to comment on the photos, the red one (4x4) you can't even see the radiator in the picture and hardly in real life because it is so far back, not the case in my 2wd

[originalkwyjibo]

You have a 2WD shroud installed in a 4WD van. They are not interchangeable and finding one for 4WD is like finding a leprechaun

[Jlhollowx13]

You have a 2WD shroud installed in a 4WD van. They are not interchangeable and finding one for 4WD is like finding a leprechaun

Haha thank you! So the radiator is in the right place? I confirmed there is some sort of condenser in front of the 2wd radiator and nothing in front of the 4wd radiator. The blower at the front is also much larger in my 4wd than the 2. What's the reason for this?

[originalkwyjibo]

Which blower are you referring too? If your 4WD has A/C, the condensor is mounted horizontally between the front axle and front bumper. It has a louvered cover on the underside and two fans on the top. The 4WD radiator is smaller in height due to the space needed for the front differential. Presumably the condensor was relocated to allow the smaller radiator to cool more efficiently. The shroud on a 4WD has tabs on the bottom that locate into clips the same as the 2WD but the bolts on the top of the 4WD thread in vertically as opposed to horizontally for the 2WD. This is why the shroud on your 4wd appears to be attached to the engine cover with sheet metal screws.

[Jlhollowx13]

Which blower are you referring too? If your 4WD has A/C, the condensor is mounted horizontally between the front axle and front bumper. It has a louvered cover on the underside and two fans on the top. The 4WD radiator is smaller in height due to the space needed for the front differential. Presumably the condensor was relocated to allow the smaller radiator to cool more efficiently. The shroud on a 4WD has tabs on the bottom that locate into clips the same as the 2WD but the bolts on the top of the 4WD thread in vertically as opposed to horizontally for the 2WD. This is why the shroud on your 4wd appears to be attached to the engine cover with sheet metal screws.

Thanks that is what I'm referring to. So my radiator is in the correct place then? And the reason I don't have a condenser in front of my 4wd radiator is because they basically relocated it to the front?

What are the dimensions of the 4wd and 2wd radiators? I want to figure out which I have and possibly get an electric fan to fit it.

Thanks for the help!

[originalkwyjibo]

Do a search for radiator or shroud and I'm sure you'll find all you need to know.

[Jlhollowx13]

Ok so I need some more help here, not sure what else could be going on. I replaced the belt fan with an electric, I got a new thermostat and bled the system, but today we took the van for a trip to camp overnight, it hasn't gotten to the red, but close. Its about 70F here,and it's fine until I try to accelerate up hills. Anything I'm missing, need to check, etc? My van has the ice box and a very large ac condenser mounted horizontally, there is basically no room for air to flow through, especially at higher speeds it seems. To me it would seem to just flow straight past under the body. Should I remove this? My ac doesn't work anyway. Also, could I convert it to an auxiliary radiator? Any ideas and help is much appreciated!

[Jlhollowx13]

Ok, so I made it home without overheating, but there is still an issue. To clarify, I have replaced the thermostat with a brand new toyota thermostat and put in a flex a lite electric fan. We did the exact same trip as last time, but went further. Since it was getting warm and my ac doesn't work, I pulled the ac condenser off before heading home today. On my way home it would go to a bit over half on the gauge will traveling 65 in 5th gear, when I was in town in traffic it was just over half or at half and even going around 35 mph it was fine, even accelerating or trying to keep up with traffic in town. Once I got on the highway it was back to 65 mph and being a little over half, when I got into the hills the temp would rise to 3/4, it stayed pretty constant there unless I got on the gas hard to pass or to get up a steep incline fast, then it would go up a bit more. It did much better than last time, so all that stuff helped, but something still isn't right.

Can anyone give me any advice? I'm really stumped. I do have an automatic radiator in a manual car, but I thought the autos were bigger anyway. I also don't think I have head gasket issues as I don't see any evidence of oil in the coolant or coolant in the oil. I'm also not seeing any smoke from the exhaust.

Could my timing be off and be causing this? Could the wiring going to my fans be too small and causing them to not function to 100%? (They are working and seem to move air well) or is there something else it could be I'm missing?

Please help!

[Jlhollowx13]

So there is a possibility I have exhaust going into my coolant. What is needed for a head gasket job? Parts list, instructions, etc? I've searched but haven't been able to find anything.

Not looking forward to this, but I want this van to be on the road!

[timsrv]

This has been covered in so many discussions. I realize you've searched the forum, but I can't think of anything to add to that hasn't already been said. I think it's more likely you haven't found all the pertinent threads yet. I know it sucks going through this (most of us have been there). If you haven't already, read this thread and follow the links in my posts: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...ng-Head-Gasket

Up until recently I've only had one van that I couldn't get a hot running issue resolved. Typically once you have the radiator professionally serviced, replace the t-stat (with genuine Toyota), test/replaced the clutch fan, there's not much else. Regarding the van that gave me endless grief, I finally did get to the bottom of the issue. Previous owner(s) had badly neglected that van and as a result it had lots of sediments/rust in the water jacket of the block. Here's a link to the thread I made when I discovered the issue: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...ngine-Overhaul. Check out the pics at the bottom of my 1st post. I'm hoping that's not the case with yours (because cleaning this out would almost require you to do what I did in that thread). If you end up removing the head, at least you could inspect from the top and poke a hanger or something down the block to verify it's not stuffed full of crap like mine was. If you end up doing what I did, I'm pretty sure you'd not regret it. I love that van now. Running awesome and it never gets hot. Other than a pesky re-occurring fuel contamination issue it's been great. As to the fuel problem, I believe that's been fixed too since I haven't had any more issues over the last 10k miles. Tim

[Jlhollowx13]

This has been covered in so many discussions. I realize you've searched the forum, but I can't think of anything to add to that hasn't already been said. I think it's more likely you haven't found all the pertinent threads yet. I know it sucks going through this (most of us have been there). If you haven't already, read this thread and follow the links in my posts: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...ng-Head-Gasket

Up until recently I've only had one van that I couldn't get a hot running issue resolved. Typically once you have the radiator professionally serviced, replace the t-stat (with genuine Toyota), test/replaced the clutch fan, there's not much else. Regarding the van that gave me endless grief, I finally did get to the bottom of the issue. Previous owner(s) had badly neglected that van and as a result it had lots of sediments/rust in the water jacket of the block. Here's a link to the thread I made when I discovered the issue: http://www.toyotavantech.com/forum/s...ngine-Overhaul. Check out the pics at the bottom of my 1st post. I'm hoping that's not the case with yours (because cleaning this out would almost require you to do what I did in that thread). If you end up removing the head, at least you could inspect from the top and poke a hanger or something down the block to verify it's not stuffed full of crap like mine was. If you end up doing what I did, I'm pretty sure you'd not regret it. I love that van now. Running awesome and it never gets hot. Other than a pesky re-occurring fuel contamination issue it's been great. As to the fuel problem, I believe that's been fixed too since I haven't had any more issues over the last 10k miles. Tim

Thanks, I've found enough to do the head gasket, I'm wondering if I should try to do the timing first, although it might just take away from tackling the real problem. Huge lesson learned on My end, too bad it's with the van.

I'm still wondering exactly what parts I need to replace. I'll of course do every gasket I come in contact with as well as plugs and wires, any hoses that look degraded or hard to access and I'll be pulling my ac compressor I think since I'll be in there and my condenser is out. I'll also get the head machined. Is there anything else I should do or replace? It seems to run great other than the overheating under load. I plan to take My time with it but don't want it to sit for too long, I've already put too much money into it to not be able to use it. I also want to make one or maybe 2 orders for all parts I'll need and want to keep it reliable and running well. We plan to take it cross country carrying a load and uer it daily as well. Any tips on parts from those that have experience is much appreciated. Other than the overheating this van and my other have Been impressive for what they are and we are enjoying them!

[nikifix]

if you have exhaust in your coolant ,which is a common scenario regarding headgasket failure, it tends to pressurize the cooling system and pumps coolant out of the overflow tank. if you are not loosing water then I suggest that the gasket is good.....and if the oil isn't milky...gasket should be ok

[highwind]

What's exhaust in your coolant look like?

[nikifix]

What's exhaust in your coolant look like?

exhaust in coolant looks like bubbles in the radiator or water/bubbles coming out of the water reservoir overflow

[Jlhollowx13]

I've got the head pulled, almost ready to take it in. I didn't notice a breach, but the gasket broke apart when I pulled it off so Its hard to tell. Hopefully this is the issue as I've gone through everything else, don't know what else it could be at this point.

[hunziker87]

I'm going through the same thing with my van as we speak and i am curious as to the outcome of yours???

[Jlhollowx13]

I'm still waiting on the head from the machine shop, they are slammed. It gave me a chance to order more parts I can across though. Ended up needing a new exhaust manifold and some other stuff. Hopefully I'll get it back soon and have it together, I'm ready to drive it again!

[Jlhollowx13]

Well, got an update. I called the shop monday and they said they FINALLY started it that morning. He said everything looked good so far. Next morning he called and informed me that it was badly warped and there was a crack between 2 cylinders. I ended up buying a complete rebuilt head from the parts store attached amd it should be here tomorrow morning. I plan to put it all back together tomorrow and friday and take it somewhere saturday. We will see how that works out, but i think its doable, ive done everything else i can already, hoses, new filters, etc, just waiting on the head. Now i just hope the block is still straight, ive got way too much money into this van for that to happen and have barely had a chance to use it! Fingers crossed everything goes as planned. Ill be posting sunday or monday with an update of the short term outcome and some photos if it goes well haha.

[timsrv]

Yes, if you're on a budget, this sort of thing is always a bit painful. The rewards will come later and you'll be happy you did it. I blew a big chunk on mine last April when I overhauled the engine. The van has been trouble free since, so there is a payoff. I used to open my engine cover every 200 miles to add oil. Now I open it every 4 - 5k miles to replace it. I also check other fluids at these intervals, but haven't yet needed to add anything. I put 20k miles on it since then (I drive a lot). It's so nice having a trouble free vehicle to rely on. Tim